Daily Gratitudes and Other Things: January 2019

How to deal with emotionally injured ppl

what do you do with a person who's always feeling sorry for themselves, always processing some trauma or other, a still liable to cry and rend their garments about terrible stuff that happened to them 5 decades ago or more (literally)?

In general WTF does a person like that WANT from you? From anyone? From the world? And what will deliver that?

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@gottawonder 28-Jan 17:14

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I don't know. I have a friend who is a good person, but she gets onto these conversations where she talks about people and things that happened 40 years ago, or before she was even born. She'll get rolling, and talk for half an hour about something like some people in her family, but I DON"T CARE!!!

It's hard to understand why she thinks I would want to talk that long about people who I've never met.

When I used to talk to her on the phone, she would get into this thing of complaining about everyone. Her Mom, her husband, her husband's family, and would bulldoze over me and talk for an hour or more about complaints.

After a while, I just quit calling her, and mostly I don't go see her anymore unless my husband is there too, because then we have different conversations.

She seems unable to let go of the past too. She talks about sad things that happened, people who died, ex-boyfriends who were jerks, things her Mom said/did to her.

It is exhausting.

She almost never talks about the present. I imagine some of that is because she's not really doing anything with her life right now. I think she mostly sits in her house and doinks around on the computer, and watches the weather channel. I've tried to get her out of the house to go for walks or to see stuff in town, but she always has some reason why it won't interest her. I know she has a lot of anxiety, and is afraid of being away from home after dark (which comes early in the winter), or "being attacked by coyotes", or having someone break into her house (she is obsessed by the idea that people are going to break into her house).

With your friend, I don't imagine there is much you can do to help. S/he is likely suffering from anxiety or PTSD or something, and it will take professional help and their own desire to change to overcome this pattern of thinking.

You could TRY to get them out of that pattern by seeing if they want to go for a walk, or see a movie, or play cards or something like that. It might shake them out of their rut for a few minutes.

You could ask them about some other interest of theirs, if they have one. People like talking about their interests.

Try getting them into more of a group setting. Sometimes they contain their stories for awhile if a group of people does something like goes out for supper together. The dynamics are different.

A person like that wants to feel better, and sometimes it's just a pattern of thinking that goes in a loop, over and over again because they don't know how to move on from those persistent thoughts. Like a song getting stuck in your head. They can also find a certain comfort in always being seen as a victim. It's easier than being responsible for themselves.

Anyhow, the bigger thing to recognize, is that it isn't your responsibility to fix them. You can try suggesting therapy to this person (bet that won't go over well).

You can see if changing the setting (like I said, going out together, or playing cards) will knock them off their loop for a while.

Or, if it's possible, just disengage. I felt awful when I decided to spend less time around my friend, because she IS a good person. I had to consider myself too, though. I felt unseen and depressed after visiting with her, and instead, I've gotten myself involved in things that make me feel good about myself. I'm happier. I'm sorry she didn't want to change, but it seems to be what she needs. I don't have to stay there with her.

@Crunchy 28-Jan 17:26

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Speaking as someone who has BEEN that person, I can attest that pretty much everything Gottawonder says above is true. From my perspective I would also say that the negativity is largely a habit and not intended to depress others, but we may not be fluent in other ways of communicating. We may think this is all that we are.

I would hate to lose a friend, though. I've lost many friends over the years, and quite probably this has been part of why. But if she hasn't yet lost you, then you would be doing her a favor by pointing out to her how tired you are of this kind of thing, and how you'd like to change the narrative precisely so that you do not become too burned out to see her any more. It would be a tremendous gift for her to have things spelled out like that, so she can see the potential consequences of this behavior.

Then, if she slips into this kind of pattern again when both of you have agreed that it's not what you want to do, you can perhaps break into her awareness with some kind of agreed-upon signal. You might literally wave both hands in the air and say stop. You might use a key phrase like "let's try to lighten the mood a bit, shall we?" But she needs to know that if you do that it's a serious signal that you are approaching burnout and if she wants to keep you as a friend she needs to be respectful of your emotional boundaries and limitations.

If she is receptive to these changes, it just might save your friendship. I'm sure you care about her, or you would not have come this far with her. But as Gottawonder said, your first responsibility is to yourself and if your friend won't honor your needs for emotional balance, then you must protect yourself by limiting or eliminating your exposure to her.

@nikogda 28-Jan 17:44

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@gottawonder
your friend is my friend, LOL< and also my aunt, and the scammy cousin we've stopped talking to, etc.

that's a big idea there, about not having enough to do in her life that occupies those brain cells, and the habit thing. Engagement in something more interesting/meaningful in the present is probably a good idea

the person I know redid her whole life last year, got divorce, etc and has not really replaced any of it with something great yet. Is just sort of renting a house living off retirement and seeing what's next.

but I know that it is not just this transition thing but a big part of her personality structure to be thus

"You can try suggesting therapy to this person (bet that won't go over well)." literally LOL when I read that. I so wish they would

@Crunchy that's cool that you say you have been there before. So what was in it for you re that process? what were you looking for from others? And did you ever feel you got it and what did that look like? IE after the interaction was there a moment that you felt somehow cleansed or complete and what had happened to lead to that?

like I really wanna know

trying to look back in my life at the times I've ranted at ppl and really the only person is with my mom and sometimes J and it's because I'm angry/frustrated at a specific thing and then either it gets resolved or ranting allowed to release steam. Maybe it is the same though? And then what am I looking for when that happens.... I will try to notice next time it happens

I wouldn't necesarily say I'm tired of it because I am able to disengage when the time is needed (IE when it all becomes 'too much') but I just want to know what is expected of mebut mainly what is the purpose of the interaction. I certainly would hate to request of someone to stop just to please me if their need were not met, if that makes sense. THere is to me an apparent real need and I would love to know what it is and if it can be resolved

IE you say you dont' go to those places so much anymore, what helped you lose the need to have that experience?

@Crunchy 28-Jan 18:12

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oh, wow. those are big questions and I'm not sure i have th answers. I would need to think about it some. Shame we're running out of time here. Maybe we could transfer the convo to Livejournal?

@malagacove 28-Jan 18:43

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Sounds like a plan. But from my perspective, frequently what I wanted was just someone who cared enough to listen. I really didn’t know how negative I was until I wa healed enough that I could see it.

@Crunchy 28-Jan 18:51

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Tru dat.

@nikogda 23h 43m 10s ago

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that is an excellent idea I will put this there somehow (still have to figure out the most rational way of doing it)

i think these questions are useful not just for wondering how to handle that in others but also in yourself IE I think about these interactins and then inev. i start to think about how I deal with my own negativity in terms of others and myself

i think my deal is that when I was a kid I didn't have a lot of ppl whom I felt good enough to talk to about things and I begun journalling a lot to compensate so by now I'm someone who rarely talks about myself but do spend hours journalling when in that space (hence my recent goal re cut that out) so for me then I can't relate to "having someone who cared enough to listen" because that was somehow never on the table for me (from my perspective)

@gottawonder 20h 54m 50s ago

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@nikogda : I have gone through phases where I know I have ranted a lot, and been very negative, mostly in conversation with my husband.

To some degree, I would agree with what others have said, is that I wanted attention, and someone who cared enough to listen.

I also think I was depressed, and frustrated with my life, and felt powerless to change it.

Everything can seem negative when stuff builds up, and there's nothing to look forward to, and it's easier to be negative because there's no reason to be positive.

One thing that REALLY helped, and I am surprised at how much it helped, was the daily practice of gratitude. I don't know how you can pitch this to the negative people in your life, but taking time each day to be grateful does something to your brain. You reframe everything. You recognize that you ARE fortunate, that there are good things in your life, and that somehow starts to rewire how you view things.

The other thing, is to start doing things that make you feel good. This isn't maybe something you can help others with. For me, doing pottery and riding at a barn where I have structure and there are other people around, has given me positive things to look forward to, and getting better at these things is good for my self-esteem. This is not easy to do when you feel like shit, but it's a way out.

I think that if you WANT to just listen to people talk, and it isn't killing you inside to be exposed to that, then if you can do so with compassion, that is maybe filling some of those people's needs. It COULD also be seen as enabling them to continue being victims, if they go on being very negative without seeking improvement in their lives.

To me, the only cure for this kind of negativity is to move out of the victim role, and start seeing how we often agree to live an unhappy life, usually by not setting good boundaries and allowing others to cause harm to us, or by not imposing boundaries on ourselves and allowing us to cause self harm. That's a bit of an oversimplification, but that's the idea. We have to accept that if we don't make decisions and boundaries when we aren't satisfied, then we are CHOOSING to stay in this negative position. Sometimes even acknowledging that what we are living with was a choice can feel better, because it shows us that we can act, or not act, and either one is a decision.

Anyhow, good luck.

@gottawonder 20h 47m 49s ago

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I think sometimes we rant, we are just talking through the problem. Other times, we are hoping to find a solution. Other times, we are hoping to just lay blame for our problems, and say "I'm so pissed off at what someone else is doing to me".

This last one is where a person is refusing to take responsibility for their life. Even if their boss is an asshole, the person ranting doesn't want to be forced to make decisions like leaving that job, or re-training, or making a formal complaint. It's this form of negativity that is toxic, because this person needs to start being active in making decisions instead of being shit on by others.

If the negativity is more like always talking about death, fear of death, or health stuff, then likely it is more like depression or anxiety.

If it's just something like being upset about some short term drama, like someone cutting in line at Walmart, then it's just boredom and attention seeking.

@seasidebee 9h 12m 42s ago Edited

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Segue, segue, segue. When that fails, walk away.

In my 30's I had to divest myself of people who spent too much time doing this. Literally. I culled. I left friendships and other relationships behind that felt, to me, to be only about other people "processing". As in, I had become the person to whom they vented, used as either motivational life coach (re my example, not because I give advice) or used as personal therapist, verbally and emotionally regurgitating all over me regularly. This occurred because I am a good listener, I don't tend to talk a lot myself thereby providing the perfect audience for people who do, and I am very accepting of who people are. Those kinds of relationships began to feel very one sided however, and I wasn't getting much out of them over time. They were not reciprocal, and they were exhausting. And frankly, they weren't much fun most of the time. I am a very nurturing person by nature, but no relationship grows when it is perpetually stuck in "nurture mode", if one person is doing more of the taking, and / or if your only role to another is any I mentioned above.

@seasidebee 8h 55m 54s ago Edited

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PS I also feel that you're dong a disservice to anyone with that propensity by being the person to whom they can continue to perpetuate that cycle. It's not healthy, for them, or the people they continually turn to to process, process and reprocess the SAME things over and over again. When a record gets stuck in a groove we go over, lift up the needle, move it forward, and place it back down in a smoother groove so it can play on................

@nikogda 5h 50m 31s ago

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@gottawonder so I bizarrely find myself in the place of writing an essay on gratitude for a writing contest and thinking I might directly want to quote this: "One thing that REALLY helped, and I am surprised at how much it helped, was the daily practice of gratitude. I don't know how you can pitch this to the negative people in your life, but taking time each day to be grateful does something to your brain. You reframe everything. You recognize that you ARE fortunate, that there are good things in your life, and that somehow starts to rewire how you view things." is that OK? Obvs I can't quote you as a person and would not use your username but that verbatim is fitting right in with my idea :D let me know

@seasidebee I'm with you: "I am a good listener, I don't tend to talk a lot myself thereby providing the perfect audience for people who do, and I am very accepting of who people are." this is exactly why this happens to me as well. And I don't know about you, but it is for whatever reason not an emotional drain for me to bear that burden, most of the time. Often I find it interesting from a phenomenology perspective, grist for the creative muse or whatnot. There was only 2 times I very ruthlessly cut off relationships with ppl like this and it's because they were repaying my good nature with maliciousness. So yeah generally I can tolerate it.

where I'm going with this question though is, what are ppl looking for with this? Is there an end in mind? Since it's a behaviour I don't quite understand but see often enough of I was looking for user perspectives, if you will. It would be helpful for me to discover what it is that people are seeking with this and the hope is that by discovering that, that can be facilitated so as to transform a toxic dynamic in them, or that failing, as you say, 'cull'.

I do think it's valuable re setting the rules of engagement though. Like this person professes to wanting to heal her life or whatnot but seems to very easily forget and go back to that same old thing. But having ideas like

1) set terms of engagement IE you are only allowed a 30 minute whinge cycle per visit and you agree that you are after healing your life
2) practice gratitude
3) stay busy with other stuff

just for an example

@Kelinci 32m 12s ago

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THERES 27 minutes left of the website and my child isn't allowing me to give my attention to the internet ;) crap. This is good info Im sure

@nikogda just now

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FOR REALS???? ONLY27 minutes left???? crap!

Daily Gratitudes and Other Things

Wednesday, January 30, 2019

Family Meeting

Tuesday, January 29, 2019

INteresting convo

How to deal with emotionally injured ppl

@gottawonder 28-Jan 17:14

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@Crunchy 28-Jan 17:26

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@nikogda 28-Jan 17:44

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@Crunchy 28-Jan 18:12

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@gottawonder 20h 54m 50s ago

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@seasidebee 9h 12m 42s ago Edited

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@Kelinci 32m 12s ago

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@nikogda just now

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Wednesday, January 30, 2019

Family Meeting

Tuesday, January 29, 2019

INteresting convo

How to deal with emotionally injured ppl

@gottawonder 28-Jan 17:14 2 Cheers Uncheer Report

@Crunchy 28-Jan 17:26 4 Cheers Uncheer Report

@nikogda 28-Jan 17:44 2 Cheers Cheer Edit Delete

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@malagacove 28-Jan 18:43 4 Cheers Uncheer Report

@Crunchy 28-Jan 18:51 1 Cheer Cheer Report

@nikogda 23h 43m 10s ago 1 Cheer Cheer Edit Delete

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@seasidebee 9h 12m 42s ago Edited 2 Cheers Uncheer Report

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@gottawonder 28-Jan 17:14

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@nikogda 28-Jan 17:44

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@gottawonder 20h 54m 50s ago

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@seasidebee 9h 12m 42s ago Edited

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@Kelinci 32m 12s ago

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